devil-linux-discuss Mailing List for Devil-Linux (Page 409)

Feature Requests item #456999, was opened at 2001-08-30 14:17
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Category: Configuration / Scripts
Group: None
Status: Open
Priority: 7
Submitted By: Heiko Zuerker (smiley73)
Assigned to: Heiko Zuerker (smiley73)
Summary: reduce initrd functionality

Initial Comment:
Move, as much as possible, functionality out of the 
Initrd.
This allows easier costumization and patching.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

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Feature Requests item #456615, was opened at 2001-08-29 11:24
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Category: Base System
Group: None
Status: Open
>Priority: 7
Submitted By: Heiko Zuerker (smiley73)
Assigned to: Heiko Zuerker (smiley73)
Summary: Boot Loader on floppy disc

Initial Comment:
Test if it is possible, to put the boot loader on the 
config disc.
This helps for really old computers, which are not 
able to boot directly from CD.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

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Feature Requests item #456997, was opened at 2001-08-30 14:10
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Category: Configuration / Scripts
Group: None
Status: Open
Priority: 7
Submitted By: Heiko Zuerker (smiley73)
Assigned to: Heiko Zuerker (smiley73)
Summary: Provide Patch System

Initial Comment:
Provide the functionality to have patches on the 
config floppy.
Different patch levels are needed!

/patch/initrd
/patch/basesystem
/patch/packages


----------------------------------------------------------------------

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Am 12:51 30.08.01 -0400 schrieb Heiko Zuerker:
...
>I was thinking about different patch levels. E.g. to have different update 
>directories on the floppy:
>/patch/initrd
>/patch/basesystem
>/patch/packages
>
>I currently also try to have only the really neccessary scripts inside the 
>initrd. I try to put everything I can in a directory /etc/initrd.
>This is then located inside the etc.tar.gz on the configuration floppy.
>With this trick, it's easy for everybody to modify the boot process and 
>supply patches/enhancements.

sounds like a great idea. I'm looking forward to try it out.

Tegge, Bernd wrote:

> So the boot process runs (simplified) as follows:
> 
> **** cutted ****
> 
> I don't know enough about the boot time initrd stuff but it sounds like
> that might work.

You're totaly right.

>>>> * Modules can also be copied on floppy, then this ones are used.
>>>
>>> Ack
>>>
>>
>> No. I mean a file called modules.tar.gz. This are only Kernel Modules.
> 
> 
> where would that be located ?

All this stuff has to fit on the configuration floppy. This is the only 
place where we can put it.

> 
>> I like the idea with updates on the floppy. But I want to go a bit 
>> further. I want to be able, to have all kind of updates on the floppy 
>> disc.
>> When somebody is finding a bug, I just have to release a patch file, 
>> which is called patch_xxx.tar.gz. The people can put it simply on the 
>> floppy disc and have an updated system.
> 
> 
> But that would have to be a separate step because you'd have to load the
> old version from CD before you can patch it.

Yes I know.
I was thinking about different patch levels. E.g. to have different 
update directories on the floppy:
/patch/initrd
/patch/basesystem
/patch/packages

I currently also try to have only the really neccessary scripts inside 
the initrd. I try to put everything I can in a directory /etc/initrd.
This is then located inside the etc.tar.gz on the configuration floppy.
With this trick, it's easy for everybody to modify the boot process and 
supply patches/enhancements.

cu
   Heiko

Am 09:19 30.08.01 -0400 schrieb Heiko Zuerker:
Good evening,
>Good Morning,
>
>Tegge, Bernd wrote:
>>>* The modules are located on the CD, inside the Initial Ramdisk.
>>Ack, except the ones you need to read the CD first.
>
>Hehe, that's the trick! You don't need any drivers for the Initial Ramdisk.

Of course.

>It's directly loaded from the boot loader. Currently I'm using a 2,88 MB 
>Floppy Image as Initrd (maximum size), so I have enough space for SCSI and 
>IDE drivers.

So the boot process runs (simplified) as follows:
- BIOS loads floppy img in floppy emulation mode.
- os starts with root on initrd from floppy img.
- initial modules and modules.conf are included in initrd.
- init script mounts physical floppy using builtin driver(s).
- loads additional/replacement modules and config file from floppy
   if present.
- tries to mount cd using modules from current root and continues
   more or less doing what it does now.

I don't know enough about the boot time initrd stuff but it sounds like
that might work.


>>>* Modules can also be copied on floppy, then this ones are used.
>>Ack
>>
>>>    Or should we treat the modules on the floppy only as an update? This
>>>makes the archive a lot smaller.
>>do you mean the initrd.gz in the bootfloppy image ?
>
>No. I mean a file called modules.tar.gz. This are only Kernel Modules.

where would that be located ?


>I like the idea with updates on the floppy. But I want to go a bit 
>further. I want to be able, to have all kind of updates on the floppy disc.
>When somebody is finding a bug, I just have to release a patch file, which 
>is called patch_xxx.tar.gz. The people can put it simply on the floppy 
>disc and have an updated system.

But that would have to be a separate step because you'd have to load the
old version from CD before you can patch it.

>But this works not some parts of the Initrd and of course not for Kernel 
>Updates.
>
>cu
>   Heiko

Good Morning,

Tegge, Bernd wrote:
>> * The modules are located on the CD, inside the Initial Ramdisk.
> Ack, except the ones you need to read the CD first.

Hehe, that's the trick! You don't need any drivers for the Initial 
Ramdisk. It's directly loaded from the boot loader. Currently I'm using 
a 2,88 MB Floppy Image as Initrd (maximum size), so I have enough space 
for SCSI and IDE drivers.

>> * Modules can also be copied on floppy, then this ones are used.
> 
> Ack
> 
>>    Or should we treat the modules on the floppy only as an update? This
>> makes the archive a lot smaller.
> 
> do you mean the initrd.gz in the bootfloppy image ?

No. I mean a file called modules.tar.gz. This are only Kernel Modules.

I like the idea with updates on the floppy. But I want to go a bit 
further. I want to be able, to have all kind of updates on the floppy disc.
When somebody is finding a bug, I just have to release a patch file, 
which is called patch_xxx.tar.gz. The people can put it simply on the 
floppy disc and have an updated system.
But this works not some parts of the Initrd and of course not for Kernel 
Updates.

cu
   Heiko

Am Mittwoch, 29. August 2001 23:39 aber sprach Heiko Zuerker:

> I wanted to know, which SCSI or IDE Controllers you use, so that I can
> compile the most common directly into the kernel.

=46rom my .config:

=09CONFIG_BLK_DEV_IDE=3Dy
=09CONFIG_BLK_DEV_IDEDISK=3Dy
=09CONFIG_IDEDISK_MULTI_MODE=3Dy
=09CONFIG_BLK_DEV_IDECD=3Dy
=09CONFIG_BLK_DEV_IDESCSI=3Dy
=09CONFIG_BLK_DEV_IDEPCI=3Dy
=09CONFIG_IDEPCI_SHARE_IRQ=3Dy
=09CONFIG_BLK_DEV_IDEDMA_PCI=3Dy
=09CONFIG_BLK_DEV_ADMA=3Dy
=09CONFIG_BLK_DEV_VIA82CXXX=3Dy
=09CONFIG_IDEDMA_AUTO=3Dy
=09CONFIG_SCSI=3Dy
=09CONFIG_BLK_DEV_SD=3Dm
=09CONFIG_BLK_DEV_SR=3Dm
=09CONFIG_BLK_DEV_SR_VENDOR=3Dy
=09CONFIG_SR_EXTRA_DEVS=3D2
=09CONFIG_SCSI_PPA=3Dm

=09Regards,

=09=09Friedemann

Am 23:08 29.08.01 -0400 schrieb Heiko Zuerker:
>Hi,
>
>I played this evening  arround with the modules.
>Current status:
>* No drivers will be included directly in the Kernel. I don't want to have
>different ways for the same thing.

Ack

>* The modules are located on the CD, inside the Initial Ramdisk.

Ack, except the ones you need to read the CD first.

>* Modules can also be copied on floppy, then this ones are used.

Ack

>    Or should we treat the modules on the floppy only as an update? This
>makes the archive a lot smaller.

do you mean the initrd.gz in the bootfloppy image ?

Am 13:19 29.08.01 -0400 schrieb Heiko Zuerker:
>Tegge, Bernd wrote:
>>Am 10:06 29.08.01 -0400 schrieb Heiko Zuerker:
>>Hmm, for SCSI cdrom you'd need scsi_mod, sr_mod, and the low level driver.
>>IDE would need ide-mod, ide-cd, all assuming that iso9660 support is 
>>still compiled in. If this was followed through to the extreme it would 
>>make for
>>a very slim system but also would be rather confusing for newbies. The LRP
>>(linux router project, a floppy based distro) uses a similar approach, and
>>one of the most FAQs at the time when I followed that mailing list was
>>how to add the necessary modules.
>>For now it might just be easier to keep a handful of commonly used drivers
>>compiled in. I'd just add the capability to load additional modules if
>>necessary.
>
>Ok, but what are the common drivers?
>Of course everything with "Raid" is not common is this environment, so I 
>would define these as modules.

IDE of course :-) . For SCSI it depends. For more recent systems the most
common are probably Adaptec aic_7xxx and sym53c8xx. That would cover the
lion's share of PC scsi controllers sold last year (in Germany). But of
course routers and firewalls are often built using legacy machines or cheaper
components, so maybe Future Domain, Buslogic and AHA152X, too.
Does anybody else on this list use scsi controllers other than those
mentioned ?

>Write your suggestions, which of the drivers should be compiled directly 
>into the kernel.
>
>cu
>   Heiko
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Devil-linux-discuss mailing list
>Dev...@li...
>http://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/devil-linux-discuss

Hi,

I played this evening  arround with the modules.
Current status:
* No drivers will be included directly in the Kernel. I don't want to have
different ways for the same thing.
* The modules are located on the CD, inside the Initial Ramdisk.
* Modules can also be copied on floppy, then this ones are used.
   Or should we treat the modules on the floppy only as an update? This
makes the archive a lot smaller.

cu
  Heiko

Friedemann Schorer wrote:
> hi all :-)
> 
> Am Mittwoch, 29. August 2001 19:19 aber sprach Heiko Zuerker:
> 
>>Write your suggestions, which of the drivers should be compiled directly
>>into the kernel.
>>
> 
> I think it would be easily possible to export all the networking device 
> driver (+isdn+ppp+slip+...) on  the disk - gzipped they shouldn't need too 
> much place.

At the moment all the modules have about 9 MB (unpacked), when I 
remember correctly.
I let all the network drivers on the CD, because this is always 
available after boot.
I have just to add the option, that a network driver can be loaded from 
the floppy disc. By this way we 're much more flexible.

I wanted to know, which SCSI or IDE Controllers you use, so that I can 
compile the most common directly into the kernel.

cu
   Heiko

hi all :-)

Am Mittwoch, 29. August 2001 19:19 aber sprach Heiko Zuerker:
> Write your suggestions, which of the drivers should be compiled directl=
y
> into the kernel.

I think it would be easily possible to export all the networking device=20
driver (+isdn+ppp+slip+...) on  the disk - gzipped they shouldn't need to=
o=20
much place.

Just my tuppence

=09Friedemann

Feature Requests item #456618, was opened at 2001-08-29 11:29
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Category: Configuration / Scripts
Group: None
Status: Open
Priority: 5
Submitted By: Heiko Zuerker (smiley73)
Assigned to: Heiko Zuerker (smiley73)
Summary: support for drivers on disc

Initial Comment:
Add support to Initrd, so that modules can be loaded 
from disc.
This reduces the size of the Kernel and allows easy 
addition of not supported drivers.
But keep the most used drivers directly in the Kernel.

Check space needed by the modules!

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Feature Requests item #456615, was opened at 2001-08-29 11:24
You can respond by visiting: 
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Category: Base System
Group: None
Status: Open
Priority: 3
Submitted By: Heiko Zuerker (smiley73)
Assigned to: Heiko Zuerker (smiley73)
Summary: Boot Loader on floppy disc

Initial Comment:
Test if it is possible, to put the boot loader on the 
config disc.
This helps for really old computers, which are not 
able to boot directly from CD.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

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I thought about this stuff.
It shouldn't be such a big problem to put the boot loader on the 
configuration disc.
I write this as a feature request, so we don't forgett to test it.

cu
   Heiko

Tegge, Bernd wrote:
> Am 10:06 29.08.01 -0400 schrieb Heiko Zuerker:
> Hmm, for SCSI cdrom you'd need scsi_mod, sr_mod, and the low level driver.
> IDE would need ide-mod, ide-cd, all assuming that iso9660 support is 
> still compiled in. If this was followed through to the extreme it would 
> make for
> a very slim system but also would be rather confusing for newbies. The LRP
> (linux router project, a floppy based distro) uses a similar approach, and
> one of the most FAQs at the time when I followed that mailing list was
> how to add the necessary modules.
> For now it might just be easier to keep a handful of commonly used drivers
> compiled in. I'd just add the capability to load additional modules if
> necessary.

Ok, but what are the common drivers?
Of course everything with "Raid" is not common is this environment, so I 
would define these as modules.

Write your suggestions, which of the drivers should be compiled directly 
into the kernel.

cu
   Heiko

Am 10:06 29.08.01 -0400 schrieb Heiko Zuerker:
>Tegge, Bernd wrote:
>>Am 21:54 28.08.01 -0400 schrieb Heiko Zuerker:
>>
>>>Can you please check, if the kernel is finding your controller?
>>>Otherwise it's one of the drivers I forgott to enable.
>>
>>It probably is. I just tried the 0.44 release and it still chokes.
>>FYI, the config option is 'SYM53C8XX SCSI support' under SCSI
>>low-level drivers.
>>It would be easier to use nonstandard hardware if there was an option to
>>load the required modules off the config floppy. That way the kernel
>>could be minimal size and still support all kinds of hardware (such as
>>DOC or CFI flash modules instead of a cdrom)
>I like this idea.
>What is about this:
>No Controller drivers are included in the kernel, they are all build as 
>modules.
>The needed/wanted modules have to be copied to the floppy disc in a 
>specific directory. Then a configuration file is loaded and all the 
>modules in this file will loaded in the same order as they apopear in the 
>config file.

Hmm, for SCSI cdrom you'd need scsi_mod, sr_mod, and the low level driver.
IDE would need ide-mod, ide-cd, all assuming that iso9660 support is still 
compiled in. If this was followed through to the extreme it would make for
a very slim system but also would be rather confusing for newbies. The LRP
(linux router project, a floppy based distro) uses a similar approach, and
one of the most FAQs at the time when I followed that mailing list was
how to add the necessary modules.
For now it might just be easier to keep a handful of commonly used drivers
compiled in. I'd just add the capability to load additional modules if
necessary.

   TiA, Bernd

>cu
>   Heiko

Tegge, Bernd wrote:
> Am 21:54 28.08.01 -0400 schrieb Heiko Zuerker:
> 
>> Can you please check, if the kernel is finding your controller?
>> Otherwise it's one of the drivers I forgott to enable.
> 
> 
> It probably is. I just tried the 0.44 release and it still chokes.
> FYI, the config option is 'SYM53C8XX SCSI support' under SCSI
> low-level drivers.
> It would be easier to use nonstandard hardware if there was an option to
> load the required modules off the config floppy. That way the kernel
> could be minimal size and still support all kinds of hardware (such as
> DOC or CFI flash modules instead of a cdrom)
I like this idea.
What is about this:
No Controller drivers are included in the kernel, they are all build as 
modules.
The needed/wanted modules have to be copied to the floppy disc in a 
specific directory. Then a configuration file is loaded and all the 
modules in this file will loaded in the same order as they apopear in 
the config file.

cu
   Heiko

Feature Requests item #456212, was opened at 2001-08-28 10:28
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Category: Package
Group: None
>Status: Closed
Priority: 5
Submitted By: Heiko Zuerker (smiley73)
Assigned to: Heiko Zuerker (smiley73)
Summary: Add DHCP Server

Initial Comment:
requested by "lermon patrik"

----------------------------------------------------------------------

>Comment By: Heiko Zuerker (smiley73)
Date: 2001-08-29 06:47

Message:
Logged In: YES 
user_id=112133

included in next release

----------------------------------------------------------------------

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Mario Dragone wrote:

> If Heiko can provide a test version of devil-linux with hdparm included, I
> will test it, otherwise i will renounce to the certification :-(((

As soon as I have a new version ready, I will contact you.
The certification is really important. ;-)

I hope, that I can do it this evening.

cu
   Heiko

Am 21:54 28.08.01 -0400 schrieb Heiko Zuerker:
>Can you please check, if the kernel is finding your controller?
>Otherwise it's one of the drivers I forgott to enable.

It probably is. I just tried the 0.44 release and it still chokes.
FYI, the config option is 'SYM53C8XX SCSI support' under SCSI
low-level drivers.
It would be easier to use nonstandard hardware if there was an option to
load the required modules off the config floppy. That way the kernel
could be minimal size and still support all kinds of hardware (such as
DOC or CFI flash modules instead of a cdrom)

> Ok, I think UDMA2 is the problem try to disable it in the bios, we have=

> disabled it in the kernel........

Well, there's nothing in the bios to deactivate UDM2 :-((
I think that this come from the CDROM drive model because on an another P=
C
Nec powermate with a different CDROM drive (also 32x with UDMA2), there's=

no problem.

If Heiko can provide a test version of devil-linux with hdparm included, =
I
will test it, otherwise i will renounce to the certification :-(((
Mario

--
Mario Dragone              Centre de Ressources Informatiques, IUFM Reims=

                           T=E9l: 03.26.50.77.93

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Feature Requests item #456500, was opened at 2001-08-29 06:01
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Category: Base System
Group: None
Status: Open
Priority: 9
Submitted By: Heiko Zuerker (smiley73)
Assigned to: Heiko Zuerker (smiley73)
Summary: Disabling UDMA at boot time

Initial Comment:
Add hdparm utility to base system.
Write script, which is disabling UDMA (when requested, 
but should be default) in Initrd after reading the 
config disc.

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